Hi Folks! I am guest-blogging over at Reason for the summer, and just posted there about a Delaware proposal that would mandate bullet proof whiteboards in schools. Here’s bebzitfbyn
the piece.
The folks at Reason have supported and cited Free-Range Kids for a long time. We are in sync when it comes to letting parents make rational decisions about, say, letting their kids play outside unsupervised, or wait in the car for a few minutes, and when it comes to other issues, too, like mass incarceration, and excessive security measures. I’m hoping that this arrangement will bring some new visibility to laws and issues that get a pass because they are “for the good of the children!” – L.
46 Comments
Sweet, Lenore… sounds like a fun summer gig!
Read the article, then read the comments. What a snarky bunch of regulars on that site! I love it, quite the opposite of my feelings toward the whiteboards in question . . .
So we gut the teachers’ unions, tell people whose pay has been lagging behind inflation for much longer than the current recession that they’re lazy, demand that they teach to tests so incongruent with the reality of life in an overpopulated classroom that the teachers have to use frigging scripts, and now they have to play Captain America?
I think part of the issue is that despite these occurrences (and despite that they are still rare), there doesn’t seem to be much actual action taken to prevent them from occurring (I’m not talking safety measure to stop the shooters, I’m talking about preventing them before they get to that point entirely). I’ll admit that gun/mental health issue are really hard complicated (and political) issues to address. I suppose there’s a whole new market for things individuals can do.
I’d hate to even think like that (kids are out of school) and the whole thing makes me sad.
(I can’t see the comments on the linked article, I suppose the delivery method is blocked on this PC)
Ugh. Reason? Really. So, are you turning into a glibertarian now? Honestly, this makes me wonder. Have I been riding a train here telling me what I want to here to subvert me into a bunch of free market fantasies? Please tell me this is just to pay the bills and you’re not taking up with that crew, which despite what they claim are simply the vanguard of a reactionary takeover.
I do not think that those whiteboards or previously discussed security blankets have anything to do with security. It might be more effective to look at who paid whose election campaign or who is too much friendly with which lawmakers.
I find more probable that the issue is good old corruption (or too effective lobbying) then genuine fear.
Yes, Jon, libertarians are terrible reactionaries. We support handouts to big corporations, treating corporations as people, welfare for billionaires – oh, wait, that’s the other 2 parties; we’re the ones against all that.
How does one manage to watch mainstream politicians selling the country to corporations and then decide that libertarians are the threat we face?
Meanwhile, the whole theme here is giving children the freedom to make their own choices, even if those choices sometimes turn out to be mistakes. In other words, being libertarian towards kids. Not wanting a nanny for your kids is not very compatible with the nanny state.
The comments ARE hilarious!
I’m very confused, as a teacher, about how or why this would be a useful piece of equipment. As whiteboards go, the ones on the market seem to be extremely small. Well, and if the teacher has to grab it and use it as a shield, it’s going to have to be small. But aside from use as a shield, an 18″ x 20″ whiteboard is not particularly practical for classroom use–the whiteboards in the classrooms I’ve taught in are like 4′ x 6′ at a minimum, which is great for putting up notes and exercises, but too big to pick up as a shield.
So, if they really think that a relatively small bulletproof shield should be in each classroom? why not just put a relatively small bulletproof shield in each classroom? Why on earth require a whiteboard too small to be practical for classroom use that can double as a shield? Silly idea all around.
While it is cheaper than that stupid blanket, I would prefer that teachers be given the option to be armed. Someone shooting at the shooter seems to be a better response than hiding behind a little whiteboard.
Oh dear lord, you’re going to get the Reason commenters over here.
Jon you better look out. One day we’ll be in power and then we’ll . . . just leave you alone.
“So, if they really think that a relatively small bulletproof shield should be in each classroom? why not just put a relatively small bulletproof shield in each classroom? Why on earth require a whiteboard too small to be practical for classroom use that can double as a shield? Silly idea all around.”
a-mom, you’re being WAY too logical.
Agammamon, LOL!
I didn’t think of that – I really hope we don’t get the usual Reason commenters here.
I think both the blanket and the whiteboard are ridiculous wastes of taxpayer dollars and that legislators who support these purchases should not be voted in again. I think the idea that the whole school be inside where each teacher knows where their students are is part of the problem. I like the Free-Range plan (stated in previous columns) of evacuating and possibly having kids out of sight for a few minutes. The authorities in general are against the Free-Range philosophy. Better that they be sitting ducks and 20 or so die than be trusted on their own for a few minutes while running and hiding.
In response to a previous comment: Mental health has been part of the problem more because certain strong antidepressents were recently prescribed than that mental health was not available for the shooters. Our society uses too many psychotrophic drugs and some of them are just plain too strong. Many of the drugs have not been tested for children or FDA approved for them, but are still prescribed for off-label purposes or because he or she “needs it”. Parents often do not have much say in this as if they refuse dangerous psychiactric drugs their kids are put into foster care and drugged even more. Many of our medications help a great deal, but they should be used the way the manufacturers originally intended them to be used and in some cases parents should have the right to refuse them. Mental health can be a bottomless pit. I would not want a lot more $ going toward that either. It is more important that what is available is competent.
Why whiteboards ever? Am I the only person who feels nauseated and dizzy in a closed room where a whiteboard is in use? We have one because my husband uses it and so the kids do too, but they know that if Mom is in the room that window better be open. Gah, that ink stinks!
I must say the Starship Troopers references were fairly amusing, but some on shields? These look more suited for the Arena but would be a useless <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shield_wall"Shield Wall if it really came to that.
@SteveS – yep, the whiteboard shields are dumb, though you could possibly brain someone if you swung it well. I am always amused at the idea of arming teachers though – I am not sure where the idea comes from that teachers are more mentally stable than others in society.
Gosh, some days with some unconscionable little ‘darlings’,if I had a gun handy, I wouldn’t be waiting for some random gunman to appear to try it out, bwa hah hah hah 🙂
I’m unfamiliar with Reason. Is the sole purpose to mock silly ideas and then pat each other on the back at how evolved and wise the readers/posters are?
It doesn’t seem like there is any thing at all constructive to be taken from the contributors.
Sure it’s an extreme and silly idea. But there have been more logical suggestions, theories, commentary here than anything I saw in the comments there last night.
I have to wonder how these were tested.
Were they fixed to something and then shot at? Because I cannot see someone volunteering to be shot at.
What calibre did they test with?
The way the woman is holding it, most firearms stopping power will knock her on her ass, making her an open target at the least. Most likely one or both of her arms are going to be shattered, again on her ass an open target.
All these boards will actually do is force the shooter to use one more round to kill you.
Gotta love security theatre.
On protective shields:
Years ago when my older brother was 17 and crazy, my father got up from his recliner after hearing strange noises outside the window. PHOOM. PHOOM. PHOOM. Arrrggh!. In the yard, my brother and his friends were having a battle with roman candles they bought off some roadside stand and shooting them at each other. My father went to the trash cans and removed the metal lids and told all the boys to use them as shields. “Stay safe,” he said.
(My brother still has a patch on his chest where no hair will grow back. Battle wounds from this night he says proudly.)
Maybe in addition to providing these shields for all of the teachers, we should consider buying vast amounts of roman candles for the students to fire at shooters. Also encourage Home Alone-like protection measures like greasing the hallway floors with Crisco, anvils, nails. and yes, Tarantulas! If we are going to perpetuate the myth of the active shooter in our schools as a daily reality, at least make the students part of the solution. My money’s on $500 worth of roman candles providing better security than a cafeteria tray with handles. PHOOM!
The security blankets are incredibly stupid, but at least I understand the theory behind them. This boggles my mind. The only white boards in my kid’s classroom are attached to the wall. Are we supposed to give each kid their own white board now instead of paper and pencil? Are we going to give kids shield-wielding lessons in PE too?
They do say “everything old will become new again,” but going back to the days of shields and each kid doing their work on their own individual slates seems to be reaching back a little far.
I think more actual teachers and parents need to be part of the descion making process that goes into school security measures. The fact is crazy random shooters are very rare can not be predicted; therefore they should not be the impetus behind major security changes.
As far as I can tell, most teachers are uncomfortable with weapons on school property, and don’t want to carry. They just want to do their job and not be constantly reminded of the war with crazy people, as if there really is such a thing.
If there is a credible threat to a school or district by people that are not mentally I’ll, then the need for armed security nearby is conceivable, but again, it is a local concern, not something congress, the NRA, or commentators on blogs can solve.
So, the shooter burst into the classroom, the teacher grabs the whiteboard and uses it as a shield, manipulating it like a super-ninja so that her head, chest and lower body are simultaneously protected as the bullets harmlessly bounce off. Then, when all the ammunition is expended, the teacher conks the villain on the head with the whiteboard, knocking him unconscious? Sure, that’ll work.
Reason, for those that don’t know, is a popular libertarian periodical. Look it up. FWIW, I was introduced to Free-Range Kids when Lenore was a guest blogger on Radley Balko’s site. He is a popular libertarian journalist/author and a former editor of Reason magazine.
As for arming teachers, it is a moot point in most states. There are a few states, such as Utah, that allow firearms in schools. I am a part-time firearms instructor and have had teachers in my classes and I know a few instructors that have done numerous classes for just teachers. I have no reason to believe that they aren’t as qualified as any other permit holder and I don’t understand why some people believe that certain professions shouldn’t be allowed the most effective means to defend themselves.
Regardless, I think this is a hard sell for most of the public.
@SteveS, how exactly would a teacher armed with, say, a basic handgun have prevented any of these situations? In many of these cases, we’re dealing with shooters with extremely high-powered weapons, and the teacher would be massively outgunned.
Plus, it takes heavily-armed, highly-trained SWAT teams an extremely long time to get a safe, clear shot in the cases of shooters with powerful weapons or attacks with multiple shooters; they certainly aren’t just opening fire on the shooter in a classroom full of children.
And in cases of single shooters using weapons they actually need to stop and reload, we’ve seen completely unarmed civilians able to take them down during reloading, without needing a firearm.
@SteveS
“There are a few states, such as Utah, that allow firearms in schools.”
Any state that allows police to enter schools allows firearms in schools. They don’t check their weapons at the door.
This is hilarious. I am imagining children participating in “whiteboard drills” running to fetch these from the closet and lining up in formation. Seriously though, if they want to put the students behind bullet resistant barriers they’d be better off hardening the doors, windows, and walls of classrooms.
I think these people have watched too many television shows where trivial objects stop bullets. Or at least they’re hoping their potential customers have watched too much TV….
@ Jenny Islander,
Crayola makes dry erase crayons and pencils. There is zero odor and off gassing with those. They are basically a grease pencil. Might help.
(Sorry for the off topic)
Bahahahaha! Seriously?! What is that dinky little shield going to do when the “phantom gunmen” start spraying with automatics? Sure holding it out like that will protect you from ribs up. But your gut, and your femoral artery (located in your thighs) will still be exposed. Unless you have the reflexes of Wolverine or Captain America, that piece of junk will do you know good. I would take the bullet proof blanket over this one. And that was a terrible idea too.
Here’s a suggestion for tall those paranoid parents. If you really that concerned that your child’s school will be hit by a gunman.
1. Don’t let them go to school. Home school. But that doesn’t guarantee gunmen won’t attack you in your own homes. Hey, if your that worried about the school, logic dictates, that if it’s that “likely” to happen to every single school in the US, it will most likely happen at home too. So perhaps, you should adjust your logic and common sense to be in the REAL world.
2. Purchase a bullet proof helmet, and body armor for your child to wear to school everyday. Heck, with the same mentality as #1, you can get them to wear this every day of their lives. They would look like this. http://bit.ly/1lEc0yg The gas mask, is an extra precaution should gas or bio weapons be used on your kids. Hey…can’t be too careful. lol
3. See a shrink, get over your paranoia. Learn probables vs possibles. You weren’t this paranoid before, so something made you this way. And if something made you this way, you can unmake yourself. After all, these fear based thoughts are unsubstantiated in the grand scheme of things. They are rare. Your more likely to die in a car crash, or get attacked by a shark. Yet, most likely you’ll continue to drive, and swim at the beach. 😉
@BL, I am not talking about police. Generally speaking, firearms laws don’t apply to them. I am talking about the rest of us.
@AM, it is hard to say what they could have don’t because we can only speculate. While some of these shooters may be well armed, most are armed with intermediate caliber weapons. Most have little or not training and most are barely proficient. If the teacher had some kind of warning and could get behind cover, they could be very effective if they shot at a person trying to enter the room.
Some of these shootings have been stopped by “average” people. The shooter at Seattle Pacific University was subdued by an unarmed student when he stopped to reload his shotgun. The shooter at Pearl, Miss. in 1997 was stopped by the vice principal, who was able to get his handgun out of his car. This shooter was armed with a rifle. The shooter at Appalachian School of Law was stopped by sveral other students armed with handguns.
A SWAT team is going to take a long time if there is a long time. This has changed since Columbine and the training has changed. They aren’t going to set up a perimeter and wait it out. Look how they handled the shooting at Reynolds High School in Oregon. The two resource officers (not SWAT officers) ran towards the shooter and engaged him as soon as they could, likely preventing it from being any worse than it was.
Steve,
I would rather the teacher get the kids out of the class, than sit and wait to take a shot.
One blast from a shotgun, depending on the load can kill multiple people in a confined space such as a classroom.
To hell with duck and cover, to hell with arming teachers, get the potential targets out. It is that simple.
SteveS –
The second teachers are armed is the second that this vehemently opposed to homeschooling (for my child) parent starts homeschooling.
I don’t want my child’s teacher hanging out in the classroom playing hero; I want him/her to get my kid the hell out of the building.
Further, nobody with casual training (all 99.9% of teachers would have) should be shooting weapons in close quarters with a bunch of panicked people scurrying about. I like my kid’s chances a whole lot better against ONE gunman than against one gunman and the 50 armed teachers trying to shoot the gunman.
And it is simply not as easy to shoot someone, even a criminal someone, as people who have never done it want it to be. I am friends with many cops and a couple civilians who have actually killed people. It is considered one of their worse memories, despite it being totally justified and necessary. A seconds hesitation due to your own natural morality against killing someone and you are dead because the guy shooting at you has no morality.
The other issue with arming teachers, aside from the normal moral hesitance that any person would have trying to lethally shot another human being, is that in most of these cases they wouldn’t be trying to kill a stranger. They’d be trying to kill, in many cases, a minor who they know. I would honestly be extremely concerned with any teacher who *wouldn’t* hesitate about shooting a teen or very young adult long enough for a person lacking empathy and morality to shoot them first.
@Warren, I agree. Shooting would only be a last resort, such as if it were not possible to get out of the building or if the person entered the room while the kids were exiting.
@Donna, I disagree that no one with casual training should be shooting in close quarters. I am certainly not suggesting that a teacher just ‘spray and pray’ or that they shoot into a crowd, but I think you have an unrealistic notion as to what would work and not work. Most security experts say that the best response is to fight back if there are no other options. Here is a good discussion of the subject.
As for dealing with the aftermath, I think most would rather be alive to deal with that or with having watched the kids in their class get shot.
@AM, you would prefer a teacher that get shot first or hesitate? Let me ask you this. If some teen was trying to break into your house for the purpose of killing your children would you hesitate? I know that a teacher is not the parent of the kids in their class, but many of them are very protective of their students. I guess I would prefer a teacher that do what was necessary to protect my kid.
I realize that many teachers wouldn’t be comfortable with this and I don’t think they should be forced, but I don’t think some professions should be denied the means to defend themselves. I also think that shooters choose places where they know they won’t face any kind of violent response.
SteveS –
“but I don’t think some professions should be denied the means to defend themselves.”
I don’t know ANY profession that is regularly armed other than obvious ones. I’ve certainly never had a job where guns were acceptable work attire, and I’ve worked in several jobs much more likely to see violence than a school teacher. We are not denying teachers some right that everyone else has. We are treating them like just about everyone else.
“I am certainly not suggesting that a teacher just ‘spray and pray’ or that they shoot into a crowd”
What guarantee do you have that they aren’t going to do exactly that? Teachers are hired for their teaching skills, not their marksmen abilities and their ability to keep a cool head in a gun battle.
With every other profession that arms itself, there is extensive training and testing and the removal of people who don’t meet stringent requirements in both shooting skill and mental readiness. You don’t just take a person who wants to be a cop and say “okay,” hand them a gun and send them out into the street. They have to prove that they are able to handle the weapon with a high level of precision AND that they have the right temperament for the job. Are you planning on school districts providing training and certification before teachers are allowed to bring guns into the classroom?
I don’t want my kid thrown in a class with some teacher who may or may not have a gun that s/he may or may not know how to use well and who may or may not be able to keep cool under pressure. Nor do I think that school districts should be in the business of certifying the marksmenship and coolness under fire (literally) of their teachers. And I really don’t think either of those things should be a job requirement, which they will become if we start arming teachers. I’d rather my kid have the best teacher available, not the best teacher out of a limited group of good marksmen.
“I think you have an unrealistic notion as to what would work and not work.”
I think you have an unrealistic notion of the reasonableness of all people. Certainly many people are reasonable and will accurate evaluate their own abilities and their own mental preparedness before they bring a gun into the classroom, but many will not. Teachers are no more or less likely than the rest of the population to fall into the reasonable category than the unreasonable one. I can think of several from my childhood who would totally bring a gun to school and want to play Rambo if given the chance and I don’t have much confidence in their ability to shoot or be a hero.
@SteveS, given that military bases, courthouses, and police stations have all seen numerous shooting incidents, I’m not sure there’s much validity to the idea that shooters choose targets where they don’t expect people to be armed.
Steve,
I am 100% opposed to police in the schools, so to think of allowing amatuers to carry sidearms in the school is a no brainer. Don’t want it, would fight it all the way.
The only thing a teacher should be doing, is getting the kids the hell outta there. Moving targets are more difficult to hit, than a moving target.
As an avid proponent of gun rights, I agree with Donna 100%. Teachers should teach (well, not really, but I’ll leave my views on school aside) not be bodyguards. And yes, I can’t imagine any district making its teachers qualify as sharpshooters, so we’re talking about probably someone with the basic NRA class and a CC class – if the state requires one.
Besides, the whole suggestion is just as alarmist as these stupid whiteboards. There is no real problem – why propose solutions that carry with them real problems?
While we’re at it, get rid of SROs.
@Donna, you sound like the worst first people that base their concerns on their own fears, as opposed to what really happens. There are studies on defensive gun uses (DGU) and estimates put them between 75,000 and 200,000 per year. Most don’t even involve shots being fired. If it were as bad as you say, then surely we would have all sorts of incidents with amateurs shooting bystanders. The reality is that it rarely happens. I think it has less to do with training and more to do with that these people are only acting as a last resort.
I don’t know where you live, but in most states with “shall issue” issue carry laws, a wide variety of professions carry firearms. I also question the notion that most police receive a great deal of firearms training. Ask the police you know how much shooting they do? This is a skill that requires a great deal of practice to retain muscle memory. Most non-SWAT cops only shoot a few boxes of ammo, several times a year. That being said, the majority of police favor civilian carry. If they thought they were so dangerous, they would be opposing it. No, they aren’t required by their employer, but they still have the option and aren’t prohibited by law. Teachers and other school employees are prohibited.
If you are trusting a teacher and a school to oversee the education of your child and care for them 8 or so hours a day, I would hope that you have more confidence that they are a reasonable person. You are assuming that on the rare chance that some shooter comes into the school that the teacher is going to act stupidly. You would rather that your kid had no chance?
@AM, the vast majority of shootings still take place at gun free zones. Military bases, contrary to what many seem to think, don’t let people carry around their guns. How often do police stations get assaulted? Looking at the list of mass shootings in the US in the last decade, only a handful were in places where people could carry guns. Do you have other information?
a-mom, I just want to back up Steve’s statement that the military bases where the shootings have occurred actually ARE gun-free zones except for the small number of security guards around. The people who committed the shootings were military members or civilian employees familiar with the places, so they knew very well that most of the people wouldn’t be armed, and in the case of the Philadelphia shooting, took out the armed security first before heading for all the other unarmed people.
And “guns are acceptable work attire” in any setting in any state where concealed carry is permitted (which is nearly all of them), and the employer doesn’t specifically forbid employees or others on the premises from carrying. That covers a LOT of places. You probably come in contact with armed people a lot more than you think, but obviously not in courthouses or schools.
Whether teachers should be allowed to be armed at school if they’re otherwise permitted to carry a weapon (which is a different question from “should we arm teachers”) is debatable, but it has to be based on reality, not misconceptions.
The chances of a teacher (or any gun owner) ever needing a gun are extremely remote. It is my belief that they be given the option to carry if they want. It is better to have one and not need it, than to need one and not have it. I view this the same as I would view wearing a seat belt or having a fire extinguisher.
“And “guns are acceptable work attire” in any setting in any state where concealed carry is permitted (which is nearly all of them), and the employer doesn’t specifically forbid employees or others on the premises from carrying. That covers a LOT of places. You probably come in contact with armed people a lot more than you think, but obviously not in courthouses or schools.”
This is a topic I’ve been considering a lot lately, and I think Steve’s point that there is some worst first thinking going on is a good one. I had no idea until my husband started researching the question how many people are licensed to carry in my state. There’s an awfully good chance that at least one person in the restaurant where you’re having lunch or the theater you’re in is carrying (incidentally, there were 7 or 8 theaters within a short radius of the Aurora, CO gunman’s home, but he chose the one with signs posted prohibiting weapons on the premises). I suspect you’re not much (any?) more likely to be shot by one of those people than your kids are to be abducted by a stranger.
The issue of gun rights in the U.S. is largely a social/cultural one. People on the left seem to view 2A supporters as a bunch of yahoos with itchy trigger fingers. That’s not really an accurate perception.
I like “tarantula proofing”. It’s a great phrase for this blog.
School shootings almost never happen. It’s just that public schools are influenced by public opinion, and public opinion is influenced by what is being talked about. Boy do school shootings ever get a lot of talk.